The IRB lays down the law

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The IRB lays down the law

Post by Evans the nine on Thu Jan 09, 2014 6:39 am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/25654799

The IRB reaffirms it will not sanction a cross-border competition without the approval of the national unions concerned. Bill Beaumont seems to also give hint that the RFU isn't interested in a n Anglo-Welsh league.

Maybe the only option left for the Regions to breakaway is to relocate American football style across the border and take their players with them.

Imagine the Milton Keynes Ospreys, Birmingham Blues, the Newcastle Gosport Dragons and the Southampton Scarlets !
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by JOHNTYWYN on Thu Jan 09, 2014 9:04 am

Are you being serious ?? As much as I want to see an Anglo Welsh league; without the sanction of the W R U and funding for what it is worth, our game would revert to amateur status.
Advertising and sponsorship would fall away, and season ticket and gate money would probably fall short of what was required to maintain the grounds and cover the expenses of running the teams.
The only good point would be that the Regional administrators would lose their professional status, as well as the coaches / water boys / and other hangers on. I am not sure how much the likes of Nigel Owen get paid to referee a Pro 12 game, but the way I see our game heading I just wonder if there would be enough cash to pay match officials.
The latest statement from the IRB, backed up by further comments from Billy Beaumont is really bad news. All four corners are occupied by the opposition and we have no where to go.
What is more, this really puts the W R U in a strong position; they have an open hand to crush our Regions and force them into liquidation in weeks. They can withdraw their W R U status and request the Unions of other Pro 12 teams to cancel fixtures , they can refuse to select players for the Internationals without too much of a disastrous effect on results; and they can then go about rebuilding Regional rugby completely under their control.

Even if the W R U were prevented from using our Regional grounds, they have the finance available to quickly redevelop alternative stadiums, and whenever needed they could use the M.S. having the option of playing games on a Friday evening, Sunday and double headers on Saturdays. The existing Regions would collapse and players would depart as regular as trains from Platform 3 at the Central Station.

It is a Black day for Welsh Rugby.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by Evans the nine on Thu Jan 09, 2014 9:29 am

No I wasn't being serious - I was attempting to inject some humour into an otherwise black situation.

I don't think it's the end for professional Rugby in Wales though, quite the opposite. An Anglo- Welsh league would IMHO mean the decline of professional rugby in Ireland, Scotland and Italy and a subsequent decline in NH rugby in general.

The reality is most of Professional Rugby in the NH is living beyond it's means. 7000-8000 supporters per match ? How can you compete financially on that ?

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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by dancarreg on Thu Jan 09, 2014 7:38 pm

The big danger is that there may be a breakaway, AND IT HAS HAPPENED before. Thta would be catastrophic.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by Old Parish on Thu Jan 09, 2014 9:38 pm

I found this development disturbing.

http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/rugby-union/25664863

The captain of one of the best national teams in the world gives up playing for his country because a European club (almost 100 per cent for sure French) will double or triple his money.

The Indian premier league has already done it to cricket ... the West Indian team is a shadow of its former self partly because the best players prefer to make money in 20:20 than play test matches.

Hand control to the clubs and this is what will happen everywhere, and if you think back to which clubs were playing football in the Premier League the Welsh regions are Sheffield United, Portsmouth and Sheffield Wednesday, not Manchester United or Arsenal.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by JOHNTYWYN on Thu Jan 09, 2014 10:40 pm

As a matter of interest the West Indies demise was secured long before 20/20 became a professional sport. It was American basketball that grabbed all the potential stars of the future.

With the intervention of the I.R.B. and R.F.U. the Welsh regions will come out of this revolt in a far worse condition than when they entered. I suspect the Union is working towards the liquidation of the Regions, so that they can establish new teams and have complete control.

I presume our present regions are separate companies from the rugby clubs that form part of their names, and that the Blues and Dragons are completely independent of the Cardiff and Newport Athletic Clubs.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by dancarreg on Fri Jan 10, 2014 12:36 am

Bottom line is that SOMEHOW the rulers of union have to get the sugar daddies out of the game and start to take control of our game.

Right now the Blues are speaking very positively about recruiting 4/5/6 big names for next season.
Question: do they know something we don't?

Moffat, Lewis, Pickering et al just make me sick of the great game I've loved all my life, and the thought of not being present at games any more is just so sad.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by JOHNTYWYN on Fri Jan 10, 2014 4:17 am

We the life bread of Welsh Rugby are being kept in the dark over this meeting !! With all the Regions talking about recruitment I have the feeling a lucrative settlement has been reached. I am dumbfounded with this behaviour, and both the W R U and Regions are guilty .

With £380 worth of Six Nations tickets sat in front of me, I am inclined to sell them; somehow triple crowns and grand slams seem rather meaningless. The letters W.R.U. which over the years have been a part of my life now take on the meaning We Robbed U.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by dancarreg on Fri Jan 10, 2014 5:14 am

According to the grapevine the regions had a meeting with the WRU yesterday, same grapevine says regions rejected the unions new offer.
BUT.............somethings going on, and as always we the most important part, the wage payers, in part at least, we are left in the dark.
When people are devalued they inevitably take their value elsewhere.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by Evans the nine on Fri Jan 10, 2014 7:01 am

Something is definitely going on. Maybe they finally realised that they will be better off together after all.

My guess is that they must either be very close to agreement or else the English deal turned out to less than watertight.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by JOHNTYWYN on Fri Jan 10, 2014 9:42 am

A breakaway deal to join the English league has been vetoed. The I R B are against, the R F U are against, the W R U are against. The only way it could happen is if Premiership Rugby and the Welsh Regions exiled themselves from their respective Unions. Doing that would immediately halt Union funding; and probably television contracts as the companies would not want to threaten their rights to broadcasting Internationals. Take away the cameras and sponsorship and advertising disappears.

No income - No money for wages - No players - liquidation - The W R U has won !!
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by JOHNTYWYN on Fri Jan 10, 2014 9:48 am

Can someone answer my earlier question please. Are our Regions separate companies from the clubs that they are closely affiliated with ? For example do the Blues and Dragons have any joint ownership agreement with the Cardiff and Newport Athletic Clubs ?
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by dancarreg on Fri Jan 10, 2014 8:16 pm

JOHNTYWYN
To the very best of my knowledge the four regions are completely separate companies, linked to their feeder clubs but with no ownership as such.
For instance, the Ospreys are owned by Llandarcy something maybe PLC who have on their board some who are also heavily involved with other Ospreylia clubs, and I do beleive that this prevails across the four regions.
There is one exception however, the Dragons are 51% owned by the WRU!
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by JOHNTYWYN on Fri Jan 10, 2014 9:39 pm

Yes I gathered that was the situation with the Dragons;  and it may have something to do with the ambitious signings they have projected.

So if the Regions went into liquidation,  the W R U could form new Super clubs,  based on Cardiff,  Llanelli, Newport and Swansea R.F.C.'s.     For some reason I have always associated the Ospreys with Neath R.F.C. because of the predominant Black in their colours;  what is the feeling at the Liberty,  would you say there is a mix of support from Neath and Swansea,  predominantly one or the other,  or is it well and truly Ospreyland ?

From my point of view I would love to see a return to the City / Town R.F.C. culture,  and get rid of all the razmataz ( excuse spelling ) accompanying the modern game.  I hate the trend these days to have a 40 year old ten year old yelling out '  Lets get behind the Blues,  Come on you Blues '.    We do not see that in football,  so why the hell have we got to put up with it in rugby.

I watched Newcastle v Brive last night;  there is definitely room in the Premiership for our guys to teach them the skills of the game.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by dancarreg on Sat Jan 11, 2014 1:28 am

Dragons are the most protected team of all the regions because of their WRU input.
My feeling is that if the WRU do ditch the regions ( most likely) they will look elsewhere for new teams. I'm aware that they have already spoken to Neath, Pontypridd and RGC1404 about filling those gaps, so, with Newport/Dragons that would be four to replace four.

Ospreys are and have become even more so Ospreylian, embodying Swansea/Neath/Bridgend, more so Bridgend and they do play some games at the Brewery Field. They could not go back to St.Helen's it no longer exists in it's former state. The other existing regions could I suppose simply revert to the older entities.
As for the future, many fans are actively campaigning for a move into the Aviva which seems to be the prefferred route of the regions.
Only time will tell.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by Old Parish on Sat Jan 11, 2014 7:45 am

If they centrally contracted Warburton, AWJ, Adam Jones, Priestland, Scott Williams, Leigh Halfpenny and Bradley Davies and then placed all of them with the Dragons that would be quite a side.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by dancarreg on Sat Jan 11, 2014 6:32 pm

Old Parish wrote:If they centrally contracted Warburton, AWJ, Adam Jones, Priestland, Scott Williams, Leigh Halfpenny and Bradley Davies and then placed all of them with the Dragons that would be quite a side.

And rename it ....................Wales.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by Old Parish on Sat Jan 11, 2014 8:07 pm

The Crusaders in New Zealand have roughly the same number of the current All Blacks ... Mccaw, Reid, Franks, Whitelock, Carter, Dagg, Ellis.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by TheJones on Sun Jan 12, 2014 3:37 am

Im feeling central contracts is the only solution now - but don't dismiss the players at the Dragons - im sure the WRU own 50% of the Men of Gwent ..

If Im wrong I apologise but Im sure Im right.

The funny thing would be the create central contract and they all play at the Blues - the rugby world of Wales would explode, good and proper.

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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by JOHNTYWYN on Sun Jan 12, 2014 5:16 am

Old Parish, take a look at other threads re the Dragons.

Cheers.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by Old Parish on Sun Jan 12, 2014 10:50 pm

TheJones wrote:Im feeling central contracts is the only solution now - but don't dismiss the players at the Dragons - im sure the WRU own 50% of the Men of Gwent ..

If Im wrong I apologise but Im sure Im right.

The funny thing would be the create central contract and they all play at the Blues  -  the rugby world of Wales would explode, good and proper.


True enough, but if you look at the boxes people say they want ticked ... best Welsh players stay in Wales, check ... a Welsh team that could be competitive against the European heavyweight clubs, check.

Maybe it is like the Americans say, be careful what you ask for - you might get it.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by JOHNTYWYN on Mon Jan 13, 2014 7:49 am

I am amazed and disillusioned that nothing has emerged from last Mondays meeting. Buckingham Palace, MI5 and the House of Lords would appear to be less secure than the W R U board room.

This week ends white wash is about as depressing as the England cricket team; only they do have the backing and support of their governing body.
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Scarlets

Post by JOHNTYWYN on Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:11 pm

Sorry guys, forgot about the Scarlets.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by dancarreg on Mon Jan 13, 2014 10:19 pm

Ahhh, the Scarlets, the "traditional flag bearers".
Seriously, they are the only region that has any chance............again.
Unless there is to be more funding, from somewhere, then IMO the regions ought to withdraw from the Heineken, or whatever it's to be called, and concentrate on the Amlin. No point in mediocre players getting hammered year in year out.
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Re: The IRB lays down the law

Post by JOHNTYWYN on Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:40 pm

What a great idea !!! At least we would stand a reasonable chance of making the semi's. And in my opinion there is no better place to develop a team than against opposition that is on the same level.

Welsh Overseas tours to Australia, New Zealand and South Africa often put us back several years, as do Autumn internationals against the same teams. Perhaps it would be a good idea to have just one of the Southern giants each season on a short tour and incorporate games against the four Regions. Not only would it help the Regions revenue, but it would also restore some public interest into down under fixtures which have become rather stale in recent years.
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